Israeli study shows natural immunity delivers 13 times more protection than COVID vaccines

Smaller CDC study shows vaccines offer better protection

As the Delta wave of COVID-19 continues to decline from its mid-September peak in Washington state, many people are concerned about the declining efficacy of the three approved vaccines from the Food and Drug Administration. The government has authorized “at risk” patients to begin getting a booster shot of any of the Pfizer, Moderna, or Johnson and Johnson vaccines.

Yet an estimated 745,000 Washington citizens have already recovered from COVID-19 according to the Washington Department of Health (DOH). Their body has successfully fought the virus and has developed not only antibodies, but B and T cell lymphocytes to provide a defense should the individual encounter the virus again.

Last week, the DOH launched a new “vaccine verification” tool.  The system provides a digital copy of state vaccine records according to the website. “You may also show your CDC provided COVID-19 card or your state immunization record,” the website states if you are required to show “proof” of vaccination status. There is no mention of natural immunity.

Does the body’s natural defense system, or the “natural immunity” one acquires after having COVID-19, offer better protection than the three FDA approved vaccines? Should someone with natural immunity be required to get a vaccination anyway?

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) has weighed in, issuing a report Friday evening. Reviewing scores of research studies and its own unpublished data, the agency found that both infection-induced and vaccine-induced immunity are durable for at least six months — but that vaccines are more consistent in their protection and offer a huge boost in antibodies for people previously infected, according to one news report.

The body develops a natural immune response to COVID-19 after having been sick from the virus. There are not only antibodies, but also B and T cell lymphocytes that offer protection from a future infection.
The body develops a natural immune response to COVID-19 after having been sick from the virus. There are not only antibodies, but also B and T cell lymphocytes that offer protection from a future infection.

However a recent Israeli study shows that natural immunity is 13 times more effective than vaccines in protecting individuals. “SARS-CoV-2-naïve vaccines had a 13-fold increased risk for breakthrough infection with the Delta variant compared to those previously infected.”

Yet the smaller CDC study offers a different conclusion, that the vaccines offer better protection. While the Israeli study had 10 times more people, they primarily used the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine. In the U.S., three are approved, including the Pfizer, the Moderna, and Johnson & Johnson vaccines.

“The increased risk was significant for symptomatic disease as well,” states the Israeli report. There was waning natural immunity identified as well. However, vaccinated individuals had “a 5.96-fold increased risk for breakthrough infection and a 7.13-fold increased risk for symptomatic disease.” There was also a greater risk for COVID-19-related hospitalizations compared to those that were previously infected.

Israel is one of the most vaccinated countries in the world. This summer they experienced a “fourth wave” of the Delta variant of COVID-19 including those who were allegedly “protected” by the vaccine. Israel has over 1.3 million people who got sick from the virus and 8,130 who died.

“This study demonstrated that natural immunity confers longer lasting and stronger protection against infection, symptomatic disease and hospitalization caused by the Delta variant of SARS-CoV-2, compared to the BNT162b2 two-dose vaccine-induced immunity,” said the Israeli study. “Individuals who were both previously infected with SARS-CoV-2 and given a single dose of the vaccine gained additional protection against the Delta variant.”

The Israeli study period was March 1, 2020 to August 14, 2021. They used a database of Maccabi Healthcare Services (MHS), Israel’s second largest Health Maintenance Organization.

It is a 2.5-million-member, state-mandated, non-for-profit, second largest health fund in Israel, which covers 26 percent of the population and provides a representative sample of the Israeli population..

During the summer “fourth wave” of COVID-19 cases, Israel battled the Delta variant which caused significant numbers of “breakthrough” cases of people who had been vaccinated. Graphic courtesy Jennifer Margulis
During the summer “fourth wave” of COVID-19 cases, Israel battled the Delta variant which caused significant numbers of “breakthrough” cases of people who had been vaccinated. Graphic courtesy Jennifer Margulis

Overall, 673,676 MHS members 16 years and older were eligible for the study group of fully vaccinated SARS-CoV-2-naïve individuals; 62,883 were eligible for the study group of unvaccinated previously infected individuals and 42,099 individuals were eligible for the study group of previously infected and single-dose vaccines.

Conversely, the CDC touts a study which came to a different conclusion.

Researchers from CDC’s VISION network gathered data from 187 hospitals across nine states. These were New York, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Utah, California, Oregon, Washington, Indiana, and Colorado, according to one report.

An analysis of the data showed that 7,348 people, or a little over 3 percent of the participants, met the study criteria. Among the 6,328 people who were fully vaccinated, 324 (or 5.1 percent) had a positive COVID-19 PCR test. Among the 1,020 who were unvaccinated and who had previously had the infection, 89 (or 8.7 percent) had a positive COVID-19 PCR test.

According to the study authors, “These findings suggest that among hospitalized adults with COVID-19-like illness whose previous infection or vaccination occurred 90–179 days earlier, vaccine-induced immunity was more protective than infection-induced immunity against laboratory-confirmed COVID-19.”

Dr. William Schaffner, a professor of medicine in the Division of Infectious Diseases at Vanderbilt University School of Medicine in Nashville, TN, commented on the CDC study.

He said: “For a long time, we’ve known that people [who have the infection], if they are subsequently vaccinated, will have much higher levels of antibodies than people who [have the infection] but are not vaccinated. Natural infection plus vaccination is better than natural infection alone.”

Some say the different results may be related to differences in the methods of the two studies and restrictions on the timing of vaccinations. It should be noted that the Israeli study had a pool of people 10 times larger than the number in the CDC study. They also primarily used the Pfizer mRNA vaccine.

Dr. Marty Makary, a professor at Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine and editor in chief of MedPage Today, argues that mandating vaccines for “every living, walking American” is, as of now, not well-supported by science.

Dr. Marty Makary is a professor of surgery at Johns Hopkins and is also the editor of Medpagetoday.com. He indicates the evidence shows strong support for natural immunity. He cites over 15 different studies showing natural immunity provides better protection than the vaccines, and therefore should be acknowledged by public health officials. Graphic courtesy Medpagetoday.com
Dr. Marty Makary is a professor of surgery at Johns Hopkins and is also the editor of Medpagetoday.com. He indicates the evidence shows strong support for natural immunity. He cites over 15 different studies showing natural immunity provides better protection than the vaccines, and therefore should be acknowledged by public health officials. Graphic courtesy Medpagetoday.com

“Some people already have ‘natural immunity’ – that is, immunity from prior COVID infection,” he said in August. “During every month of this pandemic, I’ve had debates with other public researchers about the effectiveness and durability of natural immunity. I’ve been told that natural immunity could fall off a cliff, rendering people susceptible to infection. 

“But here we are now, over a year and a half into the clinical experience of observing patients who were infected, and natural immunity is effective and going strong. And that’s because with natural immunity, the body develops antibodies to the entire surface of the virus, not just a spike protein constructed from a vaccine. 

“The power of natural immunity was recently affirmed in an Israeli study, which found a 6.7 times greater level of protection among those with natural immunity vs. those with vaccinated immunity,” he said.

In September, Makary shared that there are more than 15 studies that have demonstrated the power of immunity acquired by previously having the virus. He referenced Israel “found that those who had experienced prior infections were 27 times less likely to get a second symptomatic covid infection than those who were vaccinated.”

This affirmed a June Cleveland Clinic study of health-care workers (who are often exposed to the virus), in which none who had previously tested positive for the coronavirus got reinfected. The study authors concluded that “individuals who have had SARS-CoV-2 infection are unlikely to benefit from covid-19 vaccination.” In May, a Washington University study found that even a mild COVID infection resulted in long-lasting immunity.

Makary shared a commonly asked question. “I’ve recovered from covid, is it absolutely essential that I get vaccinated?” Many public health officials have put aside the data and responded with a synchronized “yes,” even as studies have shown that reinfections are rare and often asymptomatic or mild when they do occur, he said.

Presently, the CDC and Washington state officials do not recognize “natural immunity” when it comes to the vaccine mandates issued by the Biden Administration or the Jay Inslee administration.

Also read:

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Susan
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Susan
23 days ago

There’s going to be a lot of U.S. government officials who won’t like this! It just doesn’t fit their narrative.

MikeinSonoma
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MikeinSonoma
5 days ago
Reply to  Susan

There’s a lot of right wingers are gonna like this, because it fits their narrative.

Edward
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Edward
3 days ago
Reply to  MikeinSonoma

Human Biology is actual science.

Aaron Lawless
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Aaron Lawless
23 days ago

Where are the citations? The only way I can rely on these articles is if there are links to the aforementioned studies, not to another news article.

John Ley
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John Ley
23 days ago
Reply to  Aaron Lawless

Aaron — there are 7 links in the story. Did you click on each of them to read the information referenced?

What is it you want a “citation” for? We are a small news staff and try to inform the citizens of Clark County and SW Washington. We don’t have the time to create a doctoral dissertation level of references and footnotes or end notes for each article we write.

But thank you for reading the story. If there is a specific reference you would like to dig into for further detail, I am happy to try and help.

Lisa Smith
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Lisa Smith
22 days ago
Reply to  John Ley

Wow. That’s a mighty convenient response. If you don’t link to the actual studies, then no one can really confirm if any of this is legit. They might not even be peer reviewed.
LOL WHATEVER

John Smith
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John Smith
22 days ago
Reply to  Lisa Smith

Or… you could do the bare minimum of effort and just Google ‘Israeli Covid Vaccine Study’ and get this result on the first page:

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.24.21262415v1

(Oh, and in case you want someone to find it for you, you’ll also have to click the ‘Full Text’ list to, you know, read the full text).

Gsprunner
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Gsprunner
4 days ago
Reply to  Lisa Smith

Note that the information cited by the CDC is unpublished, thus not peer reviewed.

Sue
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Sue
3 days ago
Reply to  Lisa Smith

Look it up!

Edward
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Edward
3 days ago
Reply to  Lisa Smith

Is your google broken?

Tim
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Tim
2 days ago
Reply to  Lisa Smith

Yet you buy into whatever Fauci says without data to back it up. Odd

Deborah Sampson
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Deborah Sampson
19 days ago
Reply to  John Ley

The Israeli study has not been peer reviewed and the headline you’ve chosen is grossly misleading.

Dan Eastwood
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Dan Eastwood
9 days ago
Reply to  John Ley

Mr. Ley,
With resect, links are not citations, and you could have noted the CDC report cites Gazit et al as one of multiple studies considered in the report.

Initial vaccinations were most certainly reviewed by peers, probably more carefully than most. It’s true this was not a normal review process, these are extraordinary times.

Deborah Simpson is quite correct about the headline – you got it wrong. I hope you will re-read the article more careful and verify my conclusion.

Dan

Steven
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Steven
13 hours ago
Reply to  Dan Eastwood

Wrong how? Neither you or Deborah indicate what you think is misleading about the headline.

Bridget Hines
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6 days ago
Reply to  John Ley

Also, they approved mix and match boosters without peer review and the COVID pill without peer review. So why do people try to discredit the Israel study by saying it’s not peer reviewed.

HARLYN
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HARLYN
3 days ago
Reply to  John Ley

Excellent response Mr Ley. Thank you!

AAA
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AAA
8 days ago

The headline is typical reporting these days.

Joe Biden
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Joe Biden
5 days ago

it will never be peer reviewed because they are selling vaccines not cures .

HARLYN
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HARLYN
3 days ago
Reply to  Joe Biden

Exactly! Delay in care for normal annual physicals rendered much of the hospitalizations. Clinics Instructing Covid positive patients to isolate and take vitamins and drink lots of water and get plenty of rest and don’t bother calling back but go to the Emergency Room if having trouble breathing. I call that neglect. No early treatment, just wait until you can’t breathe comfortably 2 weeks later. Fear and isolation leading to depression and suicide. The problem has always been to STOP early treatment with KNOWN affordable medicine. I am so disappointed. (I am a Registered Nurse of 26 years)

Steven
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Steven
13 hours ago

How is the headline misleading? Are you referring to the plural word “vaccines” in the headline? (Because the study only considered the BioNTech/Pfizer vaccine, not Moderna, J&J, etc.)

Perhaps the author is referring to the two Pfizer doses for each person, or the plurality of people receiving these vaccines.

Dan Eastwood
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Dan Eastwood
9 days ago
Reply to  John Ley

Mr. Ley, please read my recent comment. The headline is not a correct interpretation of Gazit et al.

John Ley
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John Ley
9 days ago
Reply to  Dan Eastwood

We showed both sides of the issue in the headline and sub-headline.

The Israeli study says one thing, and the CDC says something else. What’s wrong with that?

They are in conflict and we let people know that right up front.

Dan Eastwood
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Dan Eastwood
3 days ago
Reply to  John Ley

Respectfully, you interpreted the Israeli study. Reading carefully, Natural immunity is 13 times more protective against a second infection than vaccination is against a first infection. This is very different from the claim that “natural” immunity is 13 times better than vaccination. It’s not, because everyone with the natural immunity has already had COVID once, and most of those vaccinated should not get COVID at all.

Reading further into the original article (Gazit et al, 2021) I find a more useful finding: Vaccination plus natural immunity offer 1.5 time the protection against second infection than natural immunity alone. The benefit is on the side of vaccination.

I’m all for representing both sources, but that is not what this story presents.

michael nola
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michael nola
3 days ago
Reply to  Dan Eastwood

Do you think those who were first infected and then got two doses of the vaccine are better protected than those who were only infected with no subsequent vaccinations or those who have never been infected and have been vaccinated?

I’m in the first category and am on the fence about getting boosted. I’m 74, in excellent health with no comorbidities. My infection, which happened May -June of 2020 didn’t require hospitalization; in fact while my cough was persistent, I had no problem breathing, just incredible fatigue, some fever, which came and went, body ache, headache and, curiously, an increase in taste, not a decrease as so many note.

Dan Eastwood
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Dan Eastwood
2 days ago
Reply to  michael nola

First, I’m a statistician, not a doctor – see your doctor for medical advice. 🙂

That said, the Israeli study (Gazit 2021) finds that first infection + vaccine is 1.5 times better than infection alone. That’s statistically significant and important on a large scale, but not necessarily helpful to you. Let me give you some examples:

If first infection and no vaccine prevents 90% of breakthrough infections, and infection+vaccine prevents 93% then having both is about 1.5 time more effective (this is called an “Odds Ratio”, (.93 x (1-.90) / (.90 x (1-.93)) =1.47 ~= 1.5).

If first infection and no vaccine prevents 95% of breakthrough infections, and infection+vaccine prevents 96.5% then having both is about 1.5 time more effective (Odds Ratio = 1.45 ~= 1.5).

So the better resistance you have in the first place, the smaller the difference in your actual risk when you add the vaccine. The difference between 95% and 96.5% is 1.5%, or 15 people out of a thousand. That’s a big number to epidemiologists, but maybe not particularly worrisome to you.

You should consider the risks to yourself and others. If you aren’t exposed to many other people, and those people you are exposed to also are not taking many risks, then your risk is fairly low even without a vaccine (assuming reasonable precautions). If you are around a lot of people, or are around other who might be exposed, or are around other that are particularly vulnerable, then the risk of exposure to yourself or others is much higher.

In your situation, the risk to others around you might be greater than the risk to yourself. I think you want to consider than in your decision.

Dan Eastwood
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Dan Eastwood
2 days ago
Reply to  Dan Eastwood

I was reminded that immunity decreases over time, so vaccination might be a good idea anyway. The long term goal is not just to keep individuals from getting sick, but to slow down the appearance of new virus strains like delta and omicron. Fewer people infected means less opportunity for new variants to arise, and the vaccines we already have staying effective longer. These are public health concerns, and we are the public, so it concerns us all.

Good health to you, Mr. Nola.

Dan Von Dohlen
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Dan Von Dohlen
5 days ago
Reply to  John Ley

We ask high school students to provide citations. Even middle school students have to cite their sources.

Richard Paul Junghans, PhD, MD
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Richard Paul Junghans, PhD, MD
21 days ago
Reply to  Aaron Lawless

The link that says “Israeli study” takes you directly to the medical article. It is not a secret.

Austin
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Austin
19 days ago
Reply to  Aaron Lawless

I think everyone needs to remember that antibodies are good no matter how you get them. The problem is that in America the virus has been heavily politicized and we have a bunch of people acting like natural immunity is some kind of conspiracy theory and that vaccines are the only way forward.

Also there is problem of confirmation bias. Everyone wants to think that their antibodies are better than the other antibodies and they want to feel like they made the right choice.

Now I don’t know the situation in Israel. But if they haven’t heavily politicized the virus over there I would be more inclined to believe their study. not 100% but I’d give it a better shot of being true. What I do know from living in america is that most politicians are an irrational mess with some form of god like ego.

Igor
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Igor
18 days ago
Reply to  Aaron Lawless

Israel Study
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.24.21262415v1

Lasting antibody protection
https://medicine.wustl.edu/news/good-news-mild-covid-19-induces-lasting-antibody-protection/

Washington post on natural immunity being better than vaccine. 
https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2021/09/15/natural-immunity-vaccine-mandate/

Individuals who have had SARS-CoV-2 infection are unlikely to benefit from COVID-19 vaccination
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.06.01.21258176v3

there are bunch more but you guys really need to put your own effort into research.

Dan Eastwood
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Dan Eastwood
9 days ago
Reply to  Aaron Lawless

Agreed. Due diligence requires the author to provide links to original sources. Mr. Ley did not even read very catefully, because the headline is simply wrong. See my recent comment.

Aaron
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Aaron
23 days ago

Where are the citations? Links to at least one of 15 mentioned studies. Must have links to them for me to rely on the information here..

Donna
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Donna
19 days ago
Reply to  Aaron

Unless CNN gives you the information. Can you interpret the statistics in the research study? My guess is NO. Move on.

Igor
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Igor
18 days ago
Reply to  Aaron

Israel Study
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.24.21262415v1

Lasting antibody protection
https://medicine.wustl.edu/news/good-news-mild-covid-19-induces-lasting-antibody-protection/

Washington post on natural immunity being better than vaccine. 
https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2021/09/15/natural-immunity-vaccine-mandate/

Individuals who have had SARS-CoV-2 infection are unlikely to benefit from COVID-19 vaccination
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.06.01.21258176v3

there are bunch more but you guys really need to put your own effort into research.

don sullivan
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don sullivan
18 days ago
Reply to  Igor

Hey Igor, the Israel study is not peer reviewed. Also it seemed to be rather simplistic study. I didn’t see anything on sample size or various traits within the samples. Things like preexisting conditions, race, blood type, age, or any demographics. However it does show that vaccine and having covid seems to be best.

Dan Eastwood
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Dan Eastwood
3 days ago
Reply to  don sullivan

@Don, I think the study has been fully reviewed since the original preprint. Although the total sample is large, the number of people with COVID is small, so they can’t do much analysis on other traits. Otherwise the study is OK (I do this kind of analysis).

However, you are correct; the conclusion of Gazit (2021) is that vaccine+covid offers the best protection against second infection. Of course, vaccination is best way to avoid that first infection.

Tanya
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Tanya
23 days ago

Of course they are not going to back down on their narrative although many of us who are medical know what they have said and are saying is totally absurd. I have to wonder about done of these medical people going along with this narrative! But then you need to go back to square one. With the mortality rate, with the “real” covid numbers, not the inflated ones that got so many places so many more reimbursement dollars, why would you push such a vaccine??. .

don sullivan
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don sullivan
18 days ago
Reply to  Tanya

You are medical? And those other medical people? Guess you medical people have no need to construct a sentence huh?

MikeinSonoma
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MikeinSonoma
3 days ago
Reply to  Tanya

You mean the completely un-substantiated claims the accident fatalities were listed as Covid?
When you look at the increased death rate they matched the numbers there weren’t people being listed incorrectly because of funding. Everybody should put that in the same category as flat Earthers claiming all science geeks lie for the money.

Steven
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Steven
12 hours ago
Reply to  MikeinSonoma

A family member knows someone who died in a motorcycle accident. He was asymptomatic, but the cause of death was listed as covid!

B Diddy
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B Diddy
23 days ago

What a terrible headline. Given into the almighty clickbait lord I see.
The problem is immunity doesn’t last no matter which way it’s gained. So unless you wanna risk dying from infection for your immunity, which 30% of the country seems to go for, it’s definitely best to just get the vaccine.
I feel bad for the many who’ve gotten stuck after falling thru a rabbit hole because unfortunately some will die there.
Don’t believe everything you read on the internet, use critical thinking and reasoning because there’s sick people profiting by promoting lies. Be skeptical but there’s a point where too skeptical can send you down a rabbit hole.
Sorry I don’t know where that went. Godspeed y’all.

yomoma
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yomoma
22 days ago
Reply to  B Diddy

regardless of your rabbit hole death comment it works both ways. some vaccinated will die just like some unvaccinated will. That rabbit hole is for the brave and curious truth seekers. God forbid anyone dig deep and find a shit ton of dirt. It’s not for all. I get it you don’t want to read something that may throw you off balance and fear the thought of anything that goes against your reality. Now i’m not anti vax i’m anti this vax i’ll wait for an effective vaccine .. you know like one of the tons that don’t require boosters after 6 months. Truth is, the only sick people profiting by promoting lies is the government and big pharma/globalist. Godspeed BUDDY

don sullivan
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don sullivan
18 days ago
Reply to  yomoma

After all those years of medical school and this is what you come up with?

B- Diddy
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B- Diddy
22 days ago
Reply to  B Diddy

I was in line for getting the vaccine and tested positive for Covid. It was a rough two weeks and easily the sickest I have ever been. I wasn’t hospitalized, but had echos of minor symptoms for 30 days.The one thing that threw me off was once I recovered, my doctor wanted me to hold off on getting the vaccine because she was seeing elevated negative reactions to the vaccine after contracting the disease. I made a conscious decision to get the vaccine once my natural immunity waned. One year later my blood test are still testing positive for natural immunity. On my last blood test, 2 weeks ago, I asked her again and she re-confirmed the elevated negative reaction narrative. I asked her should I get the vaccine anyways? Her words were exactly “well that is what THEY are recommending”. I will continue to wait and get tested every 3 months. So your broad sweeping comments for every person, not knowing medical history, replicates the sentiment like a well trained parrot.

rosalina
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rosalina
19 days ago
Reply to  B- Diddy

i also had covid in january 2021, i have not received the vaccine because i still have antibodies. it makes you wonder why the cdc does not recognize natural immunity. you think it’s about money or control?

Carl
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Carl
12 days ago
Reply to  rosalina

Money

Carl
Guest
Carl
12 days ago
Reply to  B- Diddy

I tested my antibodies 14 months after covid and my antibody level was 1303 still strong. They told us it only lasted 3 months (cdc) . Even back then honest doctors and scientist said natural immunity would be long and durable. Something very very evil is unfolding before our eyes.

Nancy
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Nancy
18 days ago
Reply to  B Diddy

Some immunity does last forever. There are people who had 1918 influenza who still have immunity. And, a friend of mine who just got her covid booster got tested for antibodies- none. Go figure!

2martins
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2martins
5 days ago
Reply to  Nancy

Some people have conditions that interfere with their body’s ability to generate an immune response. For most people in that group, a booster helps significantly, but not all. They are virtually always people that are much more at risk of ending up in the hospital and dying if they get covid, so for those people, getting vaxxed is very strongly recommended.

HARLYN
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HARLYN
3 days ago
Reply to  Nancy

The vaccine is doing what it is meant to do. Wipe out 25% WBCs first shot, then 50% 2nd Vax, …. BOOSTERS x2 renders ZERO defenses left. MERCOLA.

Hawg
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Hawg
18 days ago
Reply to  B Diddy

One hundred percent of people will die. That is a fact, vaccine or not, you will die. Even healthy, marathon running, vegetable eating folks will die. When? Only the good Lord knows.

If you think the vaccine is better than natural immunity, you may want to educate yourself. Don’t read anything recent that may have political push but a study published years before. Here is one published in 2018 (https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2468042718300150)

There is a reason doctors and scientists consistently try to mimic what Mother Natural has already mastered. A persons natural immunity will last much longer than vaccines and the booster and the next booster and the next one.

With a better than 99% survival rate, why get the vaccine? Because you were told that it will protect you? Then do it. For those that can make their own decision, let them. If they die, they die on their own terms. I had COVID and survived. And I will not get this vaccine. Again, my choice, you do you. As an adult, if you can not make a decision on your own, continue being told what to do.

Sydney Lexic
Guest
Sydney Lexic
10 days ago
Reply to  Hawg

A persons natural immunity will last much longer than vaccines and the booster and the next booster and the next one.” You don’t know that. So far all studies have shown that natural + vaccine provides the highest level of antibodies. The length of the combination is not published yet, it’s too soon to know.

B Diddy
Guest
B Diddy
23 days ago

LOL I just read the poll about vaccinating kids. Had a feeling this place was heavily antivax. I’m prepared for obliteration

B Dummy
Guest
20 days ago
Reply to  B Diddy

“The problem is immunity doesn’t last” – extremely false when it comes to natural immunity and since you don’t seem to be able to click the highlighted words in the article to follow citations, I’ll do it for you so you are no longer part of the uneducated cult. You follow leftist media and never do your own research lol. I’m not going to link ALL 15 studies this guy talks about, but I’ve linked SOME of the actual research studies so you understand that if you follow the highlighted text in news and research articles and scroll to the citations, you’ll be able to find it 🙂 I could also send you stuff about the educational hindrance and masks have on kids, who develop in school by learning facial expressions, and about how masks are entirely ineffective on children in an unventilated school who also play with their masks and faces by the minute, and how only K95 masks provide any reasonable protection indoors etc,. As well as the number of people estimated to actually have contracted Covid-19 (around 130-150 million in US as of today) based statistically on who gets tested, who’s asymptomatic, and who doesn’t get tested even when symptomatic. But I’ll just let you decide if you WANT to do your own Google researches, look for science journals rather than news articles, check BiasCheck for websites etc. Washington Post, which is what I’ve linked for you here, leans left, so you don’t have to worry if it is “anti-vaxx” lol and even they are coming to terms with the lies the government and media are feeding you.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2021/09/15/natural-immunity-vaccine-mandate/ https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.24.21262415v1 https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.06.01.21258176v3 https://medicine.wustl.edu/news/good-news-mild-covid-19-induces-lasting-antibody-protection/ https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-021-03647-4

B Dummy
Guest
20 days ago
Reply to  B Dummy

This is all coming through as one citation even though I provided spaces, so you can either type them out or highlight and copy each website knowing that the space is where one ends and the next cite starts

Austin
Guest
Austin
19 days ago
Reply to  B Diddy

It has nothing to do with anyone being antivax, I dont agree with them at all but I still respect their right to free speech.

Millions of people got covid before the vaccine even existed. It has more to do with people ignoring natural immunity like it’s somehow far inferior or doesn’t exist. In the past 5 years I’ve had an MMR, Tdap and 5 Flu shots. These have a track record of being safe and have been around forever. The covid vaccine i passed on due to having covid already and because we don’t even have 1 year of data on it yet. There’s no long term data on the covid vaccine and no data on if it will cause any kind of long term problems.

I still however encourage people to get the vaccine if they’re older, have comorbitites or if they’re immunocompromised. But it’s ultimately every individuals choice and that choice should be respected.

Vaccinated, natural immunity or unvaccinated we all need to stand together.

Chris
Guest
Chris
22 days ago

I’m the perfect example of natural immunity !

Noneya
Guest
Noneya
21 days ago

Where is the source please??

B Dummy
Guest
20 days ago
Reply to  Noneya

Please learn that highlighted text (they appear blue or green) in news articles is a direct link to their source. So when you see “an Israeli study” and it’s a different color than the other words on the page, you can click it and it opens up to that website 🙂 have a nice day and good luck!

B Dummy
Guest
20 days ago
Reply to  Noneya

news articles highlight words that are hyperlinks to the source it’s citing. So when you see “An Israeli study” and it appears a different color than the rest of the text, take yourself on an adventure and click it!! 🙂

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.24.21262415v1

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-021-03647-4

https://medicine.wustl.edu/news/good-news-mild-covid-19-induces-lasting-antibody-protection/

https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2021/09/15/natural-immunity-vaccine-mandate/

Felix Moyo Edonmi
Guest
Felix Moyo Edonmi
20 days ago

You don’t need any study to appreciate basic principles of immunology. Vaccines were created to mimic the natural pathogen. The best a vaccine can achieve is to provoke an immune response that is very close to the immunity acquired after passing through the natural pathogen. To claim vaccine induced immunity is superior to immunity acquired from natural infection is pure stupidity. Any study that is done to prove that you should take a vaccine after passing through a natural pathogen, is deliberately misleading and fundamentally flawed.

2martins
Guest
2martins
5 days ago

One incredibly important reason that it’s better (vax immunity) is that it doesn’t require getting covid to get protected. Given the number of people that end up in the hospital, or die, or have long term health problems after getting and surviving covid, not to mention the difficulties that all those illnesses cause for our health care system, it’s clearly better.

Steven
Guest
Steven
12 hours ago
Reply to  2martins

I don’t think Felix is advocating contracting covid rather than getting vaxxed! The question is rather, for those of us that have already HAD covid, is it really necessary to get vaxxed also if we already have stronger immunity than someone vaxxed only?

Brenda
Guest
Brenda
19 days ago

Once again, CDC ignores the science on natural immunity, relying instead on a smaller study without providing documentation (‘unpublished data’ ). The Israeli’s have done many studies throughout the epidemic that have also been ignored or discounted by the CDC. Dr Makary, among others, has been citing studies and other documentation regarding the efficacy of natural immunity. It is acurate to say that the vaccines largely target one spike protein on the virus not the entire virus as the natural immune response does. Research the vaccine website to verify.

JTG
Guest
18 days ago

the fact that post-recovery acquired immunity is still being dismissed by ‘official’ institutions is beyond suspicious – it suggests that there may be something going on that we’re not being told – of course, conspiracy theories abound and it doesn’t help that the father of global max-vax champion William Gates III is connected to confirmed eugenicists, e.g.,

JTG
Guest
18 days ago
Reply to  JTG
JTG
Guest
18 days ago
Reply to  JTG
Uncommon Sense
Guest
Uncommon Sense
18 days ago

The CDC study is a joke. The population that they looked at was people hospitalized with “Covid-like” symptoms. So what if a slightly higher percent of the unvacinnated who previously had Covid actually had Covid than the percentage of vaccinated who actually had Covid. They re grasping at straws to justify their decisions.

ANONI PERSON
Guest
ANONI PERSON
17 days ago

As a scholar, the issue with peer-reviewed articles is that they are also widely controlled by the narrative of the supporting institutions. If there’s a push towards the vaccine, then peer-reviewed material is more likely to support narratives and thus material that coincides with that political agenda. Institutions, are highly politicized, controlled and under considerable scrutiny to publish material that does not conflict with the sponsors. People are in precarious situations right now and those speaking out against vaccine mandates are at greater risk if their research and studies are under the watchful eye of an institution. This is an unfortunate situation that we’re facing right now, where some research is being shut down because big Pharma, the CDC and government institutions are in bed with each other. We seemed to have forgotten how powerful big pharmaceutical companies are, we seem to disregard that with the donation of vaccines, developing countries are most likely rolling into debt and facing structural adjustment efforts at these larger mandates across the board. This isn’t the time for people to fight against each other, if you are vaccinated, I respect your decision, and equally so, for people who chose to exercise the right to decide for their own bodies. No one should be forced, no one should be facing homelessness, insecurity because we are being forced to take something that is still quite experimental. Remember when you ask for peer-reviewed material, be mindful of the institutions that control the flow of information and data available for the public. They also have a vested interest in the experiment that they’re supporting. If something is free, it means we are the product. The Vaccine is def. being forced on us for free, we are the product, not the clients.

Es me
Guest
Es me
16 days ago

I tested positive for covid June 2020. Have not gotten vaccinated. My daughter’s got covid September 2021. I retested myself just to make sure I wasn’t positive. I did not get covid. My natural immunity is still good after a year and 3 months.

K.J. Hinton
Guest
K.J. Hinton
15 days ago

“Yet an estimated 745,000 Washington citizens have already recovered from COVID-19 according to the Washington Department of Health (DOH). Their body has successfully fought the virus and has developed not only antibodies, but B and T cell lymphocytes to provide a defense should the individual encounter the virus again.”

The number of cases is now 758,000. The number of deaths in 9,000.

The reality is that while of the cases John points out, 745,000 have not (yet) died from this and equate it to “recovery” is absurd.

Thousands suffer ill-effects from this that can last months. “Living” and “recovering” are two distinctly different things.

As I write this, I have two close relatives who were diagnosed with covid this past August. Last week, they were diagnosed with it again. One of them is not doing well. The other is “surviving.”

But to suggest that because they have a pulse, they’ve “recovered” is factually incorrect.

To suggest that “natural immunity,” presuming you can survive to achieve it, is any kind of cure-all and that some how, it will magically keep people from getting it again, is equally incorrect.

I’m fully vaxxed, to include booster. But if, as it’s been suggested, that the “pandemic is over,” then the time has come to shut down every program, every hospital wing, ever increase in funding and to do away in each hospital with all of the medications and equipment needed to address these issues.

Does anyone know of any medical facility that’s doing that? No? I wonder why.

I fully understand that vaccination is no absolute shield to covid. I get that I’ll likely need boosters for the rest of my life as well.

You know, like flu virus vaccines for the last few decades? But no one forced me to do a damned thing. Get vaxxed, don’t get vaxxed. Your call. Everyone here is free to think/believe what they want.

But when I see a headline like this: Boston MedFlight Forced To Take Patients Out Of State Due To Hospital Bed Shortage

I have my doubts as to anything being “over.”.

https://boston.cbslocal.com/2021/11/18/boston-medflight-out-of-state-hospitals/

Eri Dyssegard
Guest
Eri Dyssegard
15 days ago

So 6000 fully vaccinated persons hospiralized with covid like illness. Vs 1000 unvaxinated persons hospitalized. 324 fully vaccinated positive for coronavirus vs 89 unvaxinated. And the CDC wants us to believe vaccination offers 5x the protection?
They clearly have the numbers upside down.

The israeli study was looking at infection rates for the Delta variant (June through Aug 15). The CDC Kentucky study looked at May 1 through June 30 to specifically avoid including data for the Delta variant (the only important variant). When the CDC did look at the Delta Variant in their Barnstable Mass paper, they found that 75 percent of cases were among fully vaccinated exactly the same as the Israeli study.
The CDC has been lying about vaccine effectivness since mid August.
The CDCs MMWR paper is also not peer reviewed (clearly, since it is a complete fabrication).

Bambang Theo
Guest
Bambang Theo
14 days ago

I believe it is true.🙏🇮🇩

Rob Walker
Guest
Rob Walker
11 days ago

The people who made the vaccine and profit from its distribution say it’s more effective? I’m shocked!

Dan Eastwood
Guest
Dan Eastwood
9 days ago

Dear Editor,

The headline of this article is very deceptive. Natural immunity is 13 times more protective against a second infection than vaccination is against a first infection.
This is not even an interesting question – By definition people with natural immunity have 100% chance of already having a first infection. Comparing first infection to second infection is not useful.

Reading further into the original article (Gazit et al, 2021) I find a more useful finding: Vaccination plus natural immunity offer 1.5 time the protection against second infection than natural immunity alone. The benefit is on the side of vaccination.

Searching the Internet I find multiple instances of people quoting this article appropriately as an argument against vaccines. I urge you to retract or revise this article and change the headline before more harm can be done.

Regards,
Dan Eastwood
Biostatistician
Medical College of Wisconsin

Julie Nordstrom
Guest
Julie Nordstrom
8 days ago

Thank you for publishing. It’s interesting that the article doesn’t get to the actual point until the end. Somewhat misleading..if you had only read the first half, you’d miss the main point that should be written clear for everyone. Natural immunity is stronger than the vaccine right now and should be considered a wonderful ‘way out’ of this pandemic. When the pandemic first started, NPR had a superb segment on which they discussed how viruses can weaken over time. Perhaps this is what we’re missing in all this data–how many people are walking around asymptomatic all the time? In our own lives, it seems to be everyone that’s testing positive for covid, and most are vaccinated, soo…our stats are matching up with the Israeli study also. We choose natural immunity and every American deserves that choice.

Sarah Osgrove
Guest
Sarah Osgrove
5 days ago

I have a question about this, not so much about the vaccine vs. natural immunity so mauch as policy, but if the question makes you wonder about the ‘facts’ presented, I would encourage you to do your research and just for an FYI, the best research studies do not always show on the first page of search results when using the google search engine. Now, for my question. In this article, the author said “However a recent Israeli study shows that natural immunity is 13 times more effective than vaccines in protecting individuals. “SARS-CoV-2-naïve vaccines had a 13-fold increased risk for breakthrough infection with the Delta variant compared to those previously infected.”
Yet the smaller CDC study offers a different conclusion, that the vaccines offer better protection. While the Israeli study had 10 times more people, they primarily used the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine. In the U.S., three are approved, including the Pfizer, the Moderna, and Johnson & Johnson vaccines.” I have noticed lately that when there are studies involved in debates, the CDC or FDA or whoever is representing the side those organizations favor, they will praise the studies that are huge and super controlled and done with specific criteria involved.Yet, the studies that will bring to the table to back up their decisions are really not that controlled and certainly are not as big as some of the trials they will spend their arguement time poking holes in. The holes they poke are not so much in the findings (which is what SHOULD be the focus) but in the very minor details that if you question those details, really do not effect the results either way. It’s as thought they are saying the results can’t be right unless they agree with a policy written however long ago, but then will turn around and post their own research that ALSO has the same sort of flaw. At least it seems so to mae and, no, I did not check the Israeli study vs the smaller study by the CDC. Reading it just made me think of this observation and I wondered if anyone else had had the same thought.
**I am not a scientist. I just happen to have an insatiable curiosity and need to prove anything that might be considered fact by anyone I know. Just adding this so no one assumes I know a thing about it. I just pick up inconsistency in literature**

Dan Eastwood
Guest
Dan Eastwood
2 days ago
Reply to  Sarah Osgrove

“SARS-CoV-2-naïve vaccines had a 13-fold increased risk for breakthrough infection with the Delta variant compared to those previously infected.”

This conclusion is worthless to anyone wanting to avoid a first infection. Who cares about protection versus second infection when you are still trying to avoid the first?

The only useful interpretation I get out of this is about how well the current vaccines are doing against the Delta variant. People still have better protection from infection (first or second) with a vaccine than without.

Stay curious! 🙂

Sarah Sheets
Guest
Sarah Sheets
3 days ago

Was this Israeli study a double blind study?

Dan Eastwood
Guest
Dan Eastwood
2 days ago
Reply to  Sarah Sheets

No. It’s very difficult to blind a study on this scale, and you can’t blind people from knowing they have already had COVID.

Susan Sonoma
Guest
Susan Sonoma
2 days ago

You have to risk getting an illness that puts you in the hospital in order to be “protected”. Otherwise, the protection that’s built up from infection may be inadequate.

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